I've had George Michael on loop in my head for the past couple days, I've been singing father figure into a hairbrush. What a perfect song to have in a film all about domination and submission and daddy kinks and all that stuff. I went to go see baby girl, and as you can probably tell, this episode of beyond the bedroom is gonna be all about the film and the discourse surrounding it, and questions you may have about kink I have a little bit of a different take than a lot of other people in my field may have, and I'll explain why. But I want to go see the movie. I loved it and and I'm gonna plead my case here, of course, if you want to go to the film and you didn't like it, it's still a good episode for you to listen to, because I'm really just talking about the ins and outs of the stuff that was portrayed and what I didn't like about it, and why I liked it, and all that stuff. If you did see the movie and you loved it, this is also a perfect episode for you to listen to, because I'm sure you're still gonna learn something. If you haven't seen the movie and you still want to skip this episode and come back after you've watched it, because it's gonna be tons of spoilers. It's gonna have so so so many spoilers in it, because I'm really dissecting all of the stuff depicted. If you haven't seen the movie and you don't want to see the movie, but you're still interested in this episode. Stay, stick around. Listen to us talk about kink, right? I say us in the the royal we because just me, but you guys are here listening to me, so telepathically, we can all communicate. But yeah, welcome back to beyond the bedroom. And I'm a little under the weather this week, so I sound a little different, and I'm a little less energized than usual. I am excited to talk about this. I'm getting so many questions about it, and I've talked to a lot of other sex educators all about it. I try to limit, though, how much content about the movie I consumed, minus things directly from the director until I kind of formed my thoughts, and now I've been discussing back and forth with a lot of colleagues, and it's been really great to be able to talk about it. The film was directed by Helena rain, and she did a great job. And it's a story about Nicole Kidman's characters, Romy Mathis, or Romy, Romy, and then Jacob, her husband, and then Samuel, of course, is the intern. So that's just a little recap of the the characters names. The biggest thing we see here is people are talking about this, this power difference, and this is kind of the biggest discourse I see online. So I'm gonna just jump into this topic first, and then you'll hear a little bit more of my take in a bit. Also in this episode, I'm going to be going through most of the kinks that I saw depicted in the scenes and discuss a little bit more about what they are. So if you were curious about them or wanted to learn more about what was going on in the movie, I'll break that down, and I'm also answering some listener questions as well at the end. So Romy people argue that she's taking advantage of Samuel due to their power difference, and that's true. She's engaging in a romantic relationship with an employee, with a subordinate. She is the CEO, and he's an intern. Samuel tries to explain that he is really the one with all the power. And technically, two things can be true. You can be in a position of power over someone, as you know, it's an employee, employer situation, but also he has physical power over you in the scenario, or he can extort or blackmail you. However, in terms of extortion and blackmail, if you were an active participant in something, you know, you still had power over them. So it's like, it's like, they're not really blackmailing you if they're just coming forward with, you know, if they're just going to HR, and being like, my boss is initiating this with me. So there's like a lot to discuss there, right? And that's what makes this movie so good, is that there is so much gray area to move through. And I think it's really interesting when people are like, wow, like, Romy is in this, in the submissive role, despite being the dominant power dynamic in in real life, like being the one in in charge. But I think that's really, really common. And this is, this is true for not just like, very specific kinks, but also just broadly, like idea of being like a very high powered person. We see really rich people that work on Wall Street, for example, like stock brokers. They go and they seek out Doms, like pro Doms downtown, because they just they love the idea of somebody dominating them despite all of the power and status they have in the world, and often it's the people who are very high strung and very structured that crave the freedom of being told what to do and being given also directions on how to let go in their sex life. You know, somebody else is creating a free. Framework for them and being like, okay, here is where you can play. And that is a very exciting idea to a lot of people who are in very structured or very high powered lives, but in terms of their power dynamic, Samuel does push her boundaries. He introduces himself to her family. He keeps pushing and pushing. He also goes and and tells her, you know, you have to do everything I say or else I'll tell everybody. This is obviously like putting her through a very high stress situation. But was the black male a part of the kink? And that is something that people may not be considering always, is that there are a lot of people who are, at the end of the day, like their biggest fantasy is that everybody in their life finds out, because it's like the humiliation and the shame of people being like, Wow, you did this. You're a cheater, you're a sissy. You know, that's the stuff that we hear all the time, or, wow, like you let a man do these things to you, or just like you did something we find weird, it's the simultaneous feeling of both shame and humiliation and the freedom of like, I don't have to live with the secret anymore, that can be very intriguing to a lot of People. And some people have this kink of self sabotage, where they are not self sabotaging, but if they put themselves in a position where someone else can ruin them, so to speak, they don't have to be an active participant in it. And that is what is so exciting to them. And I want you to remember that just because something is different to us. It doesn't make it necessarily weird or bad, but I do think it's really interesting that people have really been desperate to sort and categorize sexual behaviors for a long time, like those of us in this field, and the majority of people don't want to know more about their kinks, they are kind of seeking them out and like, if they if they know a lot about it, if they're able to communicate about it, unfortunately, they the shame kicks in, and they can no longer participate in it. And another thing people are talking about a lot is the fact that Romy told Jacob that she's never had an orgasm with him in over 19 years of being together. And this is not an entirely uncommon scenario, especially considering how many women I know have told me that they never had an orgasm until they were like 35 or older, like maybe 50. I've heard people say that to me, that's like another theme here, where it's like the idea that sexuality is more than just physical is in and pleasure is beyond, beyond the flesh. It's it's not just purely physical. Is a very interesting thing. Another thing I keep seeing popping up is like, Oh, is she a porn addict? Because she goes and watches it after having sex with her husband. And I think that that's like the wrong question to ask. Instead, I'd ask, why does she feel like she has the urge to go and watch a specific type of sexual scenario in order to get off and why isn't that showing up in her sex life? Speaking of the film is not a good depiction of the lifestyle. Many people I know are very deep in the lifestyle, and they are doing things in a way more consensual, safe, healthy way. Of course, this is not a safe or healthy depiction of kink, but it's not supposed to be. I'd argue that it's an accurate portrayal of how many people fall into this scenario, and how people often act out their kinks. So many people find themselves in a position where they've had this urge for so long, and when it finally happens, it kind of throws their whole life into a tailspin. Many sex educators also are very black and white with like, this is the right way to do things. This is the wrong way to do things, and people in general tend to forget that like media and art, and this is art. This is cinema. There's going to be a lot of unlikable characters. That's what makes it exciting. If Romy had just told her husband, hey, I want to be blindfolded. I want you to finger me in a specific way, and I want to feel dominated by you and humiliated. There would be no movie. There wouldn't have been a movie like then she would have just been figuring that out with her husband. The movie is like a like a tale of what happens when you're so desperate for it that you end up consumed by your urges, and then your urges consume your life. If the scene never ends, and the scene means like a like a kinky scenario, or like, kind of a time for kinky play, if the scene never. Ends then it's arguably, it's abuse. So I think it's a really good depiction of how easily people fall into these scenarios when they don't understand their urges and when they don't want to learn about them and they don't want to advocate for yourself. Throughout the entire film, we see that this woman is not an advocate for herself. She is very good at driving herself forward, but then she doesn't do things that make her feel good. She's always putting other people first. She's She doesn't want to dance with her family at the office function because she doesn't want to let loose in that way around other people. Vulnerability is extremely difficult for her. She cannot communicate her deepest urge to her husband because she's so ashamed by it. We see this happen again and again, and I think that that's what makes this character so great, is that she has so much complexity. She is a very multi layered, multi faceted, deep character, and I that's, it's so exciting to watch that play out. I think that, as sex educators, it's always important to engage in harm reduction. So people have gone and seen this movie, and now we can point out, Hey, if you're into this, this is a better way to do it. This is a safer way to do it, because this is not a good depiction of the lifestyle, because it's not supposed to be it's supposed to be like this is what happens when you don't advocate for yourself, when you don't learn about what you're doing, and a lot of people are afraid to even Google what their kinks are. Instead, they end up just seeking these sensations and seeking out these scenarios and even things like, we should have a safe word, right? Like, when he's asking about, like, having a safe word, and she's like, Yeah, I'm choosing my husband's name as a safe word. People were like, oh my god, like in the theater, and it makes for very good cinema. But then I'm like, Yeah, you know, that's sometimes a part of it for people and yes, according to these rules that we have created for having a healthier, safer relationship with BDSM or any kind of kink, safe words should not have emotionally activating responses to them. They should be safe words are supposed to be something frivolous, like we hear the joke a lot of like, my safe word is pineapple or grapefruit or cacao because they're supposed to be random words that we don't associate with anything. So if you're screaming out your husband's name as your safe word, that's obviously creating an emotional response. However, there are caveats and nuance. There are Doms that have two safe words for their clients, and sometimes one of the safe words is something that elicits an emotional response because it adds to the kink. And then the other ones like a real like, okay, back off. I'm done, type of safe word. And then there's people who don't need safe words, because, if they're like, if I say stop, I mean, stop, because it's not a part of their kink, to be bratty or to talk back or consensually not consent. And, you know, their kink involves something very specific, like impact play, where the dynamic is more of a giver and receiver thing, rather than a dominant and submissive. So I think it's really important to remember that, you know, there's a lot of levels to these types of things. And for the most part, you know, when I worked at a sex toy store, a lot of people would come in and they would get bondage gear, and they would not even be able to say it out loud what they were looking for. They wouldn't even be able to, like, tell their partner exactly like what they wanted from it. I think that that's a really common situation, you know. I think it's really important that people in in this industry remember, like, we're not the norm in terms of like, you know, we go and we watch, and the audience is like, Oh my God. Like laughing because her orgasm sounds very different than what is often depicted in porn, for example, when she's, you know, having sex with her husband, in the opening scene, she has an orgasm that's very like, it's moany and groany, but it's, it's very different than the one that we hear when she's watching porn, like just right after, and she's watching very specific scenario of Like the daddy DOM, and you hear like the woman, like, say the word daddy. And you hear this dynamic. You can just tell it's a very specific type of porn. The orgasm she has there is like guttural and more like a grunt and like, very similar to how many, many women sound when they come. We hear it again when Samuel fingers her and she I think she squirts, because she's like, I feel like I have to pee and I don't want to pee. And I think that that's really interesting, because a lot of the time in movies and in porn and just in general, we don't really ever hear this a guttural orgasm. Sound that a lot of people have. So yeah, like, I like the movie in terms of the accurate portrayal of, like, what can go wrong and what can kind of happen when the scene never ends, and why it's important to advocate for yourself. And I think that after I read an interview with the director, and she said, you know, the same thing, like, I really liked the movie more in that regard, because I was like, oh, like, like, it's still a sex positive film, even though it's a film about, like, what can go wrong, it's still like, you know, at the end of it, she's very happy. It has a happy ending. Like, for everyone involved, she's still engaging in kink at the end of the film, you know, and I see a lot of judgment for her character online, and not necessarily because she's engaging in BDSM, well, because she, like, is a cheater. I guess because she cheated, we get this back story where it's like she grew up in a cult, you know, you can kind of speculate a lot, it's like communication is probably pretty difficult for her. Maybe upbringing in a cult, maybe vulnerability was like weaponized or used as a currency, like in many cults, information is currency. Information on people becomes like a weapon, and she ends up in a situation where she could easily be blackmailed, which is probably really emotionally activating for her because of that, and she also may be acting reckless because of how intense all these feelings are. People can relate to a scenario or a situation that they've been in where things got really heated and they were very emotionally activated, and they gave in to maybe something that felt really good in the moment, despite not necessarily doing that at any other time. They're like, I don't know what came over me, whether it's, you know, I don't know like partying harder than you would, or hooking up with that person that you're like, if I was not feeling that way, I don't think I would do that. You know, I think the the idea that orgasms are a lot more and pleasure is a lot more mental than it is physical, plays a really big role here. And so this isn't a how to on kink, as others you know have pointed out. And especially, I'm going to link some articles in the show notes, and you can find the show notes, by the way, on beyond the bedroom.org, you can find all the podcast episodes and the show notes there. But this isn't a how to on kink. It's, it's like, more of a, like, just like a tale, like a just a story. And I would add that reading the director's intentions makes the film even better. I think it like many a 24 films, it kind of warrants a re watch. It demands a re watch, not necessarily for clarity, but because reflecting on these characters feels really good, like it's very similar to other films that have that twist at the end. This one didn't really have a twist at the end. It's more just like, you go back after kind of mulling it over, and you're like, oh, wait, I want to see it from the beginning. Like, did she set up the blackmail from the beginning? You know, I think it's also in terms of, like, it's not a how to on kink. One line in particular is very important in that where Samuel was trying to kind of set some rules or boundaries within their dynamic, and she's like, did you just fucking look that up in a library or something? It shows, like a lot of people, they just don't want to know. They're like, I like to be spanked and have my hair pulled and be called a good girl, and I want to be daddy's little girl, and I want you to XYZ and, and it's like, Well, anytime you try to talk about that outside of the bedroom, they're like, no, no, no stop. I don't want to talk. It's like, embarrassing, and I get it feels very vulnerable, especially if you're like, This is not allowed. This is not the norm, though, the same thing that turns you on about it is the same thing that makes you hate a part of yourself for engaging in that it's humiliation and shame, right? They're very tricky, fickle emotions. And as someone who not just worked at a sex shop but taught BDSM workshops, I can attest to the fact that those who often need the safety protocol the most are the ones least likely to learn it for themselves. And in an interview with the director, it was in Cosmopolitan magazine, and I was like, damn, Cosmo has gotten very good, like a lot of great sex educators writing for Cosmo now, there was an article actually on Cosmo, that says the film doesn't depict what the dynamic of dominant and submissive should be, but rather what it shouldn't, and that's by design. In an exclusive interview, the director says, My movie is a warning. We're witnessing two people who are not doing it totally right. They. Have no experience in the DOM sub world. My movie is a fable. It's not a documentary, it's a cautionary tale. And I thought that that was really interesting. Yes, it's highly unethical. A lot of people don't really care about ethics, and she's a really great example of it. Like, look at the CEO. She is leading the world in robotic automation, which is an ethical conundrum in itself. She is engaging in a relationship with an intern, and she lied about it, something that we impeached a president for people are upset that there was no conversation on consent and yeah, that's like the whole point her lack of communication and her weak boundaries, stemming probably from her very well hidden, deep insecurities is a huge issue in her life. Even when she gets what she wants, she can't really be happy. And there was an interview with Amanda dames, who is also known as the kink consultant, and she said something really interesting. She said the film shows a lot of the downsides of starting a DOM sub relationship without any established boundaries or discussion. And she says that this relationship is common. When people are new to kink and don't know how to practice responsibly, they don't do any research before engaging. And I agree, as I mentioned, this is like a huge part. That's why I love the film, because it's so real, like, it's super, super, super unrealistic in terms of, like, people would not, out of nowhere go from being okay, like, we're four minutes into a discussion, and now all of a sudden I'm kissing you and telling you to get down on your knees because, like, you're my boss. Like, that whole part of it was obviously very unrealistic, but it's, I'm saying it's like a very real depiction of when people are totally new to this and they don't know what many people before them have kind of figured out and and thought about this is, this is kind of what happens. And terms like dominant and submissive don't necessarily equate to the dynamic outside of their sex life, always for people and her sex life, Romys, in the film, exists in other settings beyond her sexual behavior, so I wonder how her life had been different if she was just able to be a vocal advocate for herself and her desires. But this film is about just that, if you don't speak up for yourself, if you don't advocate for your desires, if you don't put yourself first, you end up in a very, very hot water, and you're doing yourself a disservice. But the film is a really great conversation starter, because so many people have questions afterwards, and then I'm gonna link this interview, but the director also she says, I wanted to make a story about if, if it is possible as a woman to love all the different layers of yourself, and not just the ones that you're okay with presenting to the outside world, the ugly, the weak, the flawed, the shameful, the embarrassing. I wanted to create a comedy of manners, a fable about consent, sex, power and feminism, and I really enjoyed that. And when she says, like in the film, when she goes, I want to be normal. I want to just be what you like. I think this is a moment that so many women can relate to, and many people in general can relate to, especially those who are kinky or queer or hide those parts of themselves for so long, even from themselves, they may engage in some sort of behavior like they may. They may watch very, very, very kinky porn, but then they're like, no, no, I'm not kinky. They might always be feeling these urges with other people, but when they come to their partner, they're like, I don't even, I don't even know how to bring this up. And I'm really also happy that Romy acknowledges that she tried so much therapy to get rid of it, but at the end of the day, this is just an urge that she has. Side note, I really like that they showed EMDR therapy. This the light kind of bouncing back and forth. I really love that they showed that it was a really great depiction of it. And I really loved the casting choice of Antonio Banderas, because he's been seen as such a, like, powerful sex symbol, like when I went to go see the the film with my husband, and he was like, oh, that's Zorro. Like, I remember him from those movies too. And I just remember people having a huge crush on him, and just how, you know, sexy, a lot of people found him. So it was like the perfect choice, because it shows suddenly when this sexy, masculine, powerful man with a great career suddenly becomes not enough. I see this a lot in my personal life, because the conflation between like masculinity and the ownership of pleasure, being the provider of pleasure, so to speak, is so important. I think that in their scenario, he's not the sole breadwinner. Arguably, she might make more money. In him, but he's like a he's a very high powered theater director, so who knows. But I think it's very important to notice here, a lot of men feel this need to provide and so when you are making them aware of the fact that they're actually not providing pleasure to the partner, it can seem like a very deep personal attack on their masculinity, and they don't always know where that's coming from. And I think they did a really good job in this film exploring that. When, you know, she's like, I've never had an orgasm in 19 years, and he's like, Well, you know, like some women have issues with that, and is this true, like all that stuff, I think it's really interesting to show that some other guy could make her come really quickly because she was making a choice to engage in a different type of sexual behavior with him. It's the idea of being fulfilled by something as opposed to being pleasured. And that this idea that, like Jacob, he could dominate her if she wanted to. He's powerful, both physically, socially, emotionally, and the issue is, she's not asking for it. It's funny because it reminds me a bit of the Madonna whore complex that we discuss a lot, in the opposite way, where it's like, men sometimes are like, I cannot act out this fantasy on you because I respect you too much. Women sometimes also like, internalize that and like, no, no, I'm a respectable woman, like, I can't, I can't do that, or like we're in a marriage, like married people don't spank each other, like whatever. I also think that this movie is just as much about the modern day ambiguity of polyamory as it is about kink. And hear me out. Okay, so that scene where she sees her daughter doing kind of the same thing, playing around with someone else, when her daughter is like, Yeah, I'm still with Mary. I still like Mary. I'm just playing around with this neighbor girl. And it's the same daughter who eventually pulls her back home. And it reminds me of that bonding moment that the two of them have sharing a cigarette in the kitchen. I think that seeing her daughter being so authentic in her expression, in her sexuality and in her communication with her partner, where her partner forgives her and stuff, it gave her hope, because she sees so much of her daughter and herself, even though they're so different physically, and they're so different in terms of their like, the way they move through life, they're still so similar, and it's quite admirable. And I always appreciate when people who are older than me admit that they're learning things from younger generations, especially like from their children, because we can all learn and grow so much together. I think that it's really admirable that she did, that her daughter also saw her mom's needs in that way. And I think that that's why it's also a very feminist film. And when I say polyamory, it's like just the idea that you can have very strong feelings for more than one person at the time. Like Romy is still extremely in love with Jacob and cherishes him and wants to be with him, and like they're still having sex regularly, even after 19 years and you know, but she feels very powerful feelings towards Samuel. Same thing with her daughter, feeling this thing for the then Mary, and also for the neighbor girl. And then cutting it off with the neighbor girl, because she would rather just be with Mary. And Mary forgave her. And then Samuel saying to Romy that he is seeing the other girl like at the office, who you know, later, I guess, is part of this black male king. He's seeing her, but she's into different things, and he is a different person with her, and he likes himself differently with her, as opposed to, you know, with this, with Romy. I thought that was a really, really great depiction of how a lot of people move through open relationships and polyamory, because it's like, well, different people bring out different sides of me, and I like different people for different things, and I'm fulfilling my needs with you and with her differently. And that was kind of interesting. I thought that was really interesting because it is such an overlap with like kink a lot of the time. I think it's a really great depiction, also, of like, when you want your partner to basically be psychic, and you cannot rely on that at all. So let me, let me dive into some questions here. Some people ask some very like, movie specific questions, and then at the end, I'll get into some listener questions more about kinks in general. Is cheating justified in this scenario because it led to her having a better sex life? I don't think we can necessarily be the moral arbiters of every single couple, especially in fictionalized relationships, right? I don't think the cheating was justified, and it was definitely. To the detriment of herself and those around her, and that's a big part of the movie. Like you're not supposed to be justifying the characters actions just just to be able to enjoy the movie, like you're supposed to say, Wow, she did a bad thing, but she learned a valuable lesson, and now their relationship has a new chapter involving forgiveness, and that's an interesting story that's being told a lot of the time. We can just observe, and we don't have to assign anything like any moral assignments to that. I don't know if it was justified, because, again, I'm not trying to say what was right or wrong, because it's not entirely so black and white. We see at the end that her and her husband are engaging in the stuff that she likes, and they're happy, and a lot of people are upset with that. They're like, no like, there was no resolution. Like, we wanted to see more of them and we wanted to see more of the fight, or, like, I wanted to see him leave, and it's like, well, that's the thing about this type of movie like it leaves you with a lot of questions, because in real life, people go back to someone they that cheated on them. Sometimes people have a better relationship because of indiscretion, and sometimes it blows up completely and they're betrayed and hurt forever. It's so different. I think there's one thing to engage in, like betrayal violence, which is like when somebody goes out of their way to see many different people and lie about it. And betrayal, violence is very intense, and it is often a abusive tactic. And that's not necessarily what I'm seeing in this movie, I'm seeing more an affair, and that's very difficult for people to go through. What would you have depicted differently about the sex scenes? Specifically? So not the kinks, but the way the characters had sex. So I was actually talking to a friend of mine, and we said the same thing, which is really interesting. And she's a pro DOM, and so I felt very vindicated in this, and she's gonna be on the podcast in the next couple weeks. So that's that's also very exciting for all of you to be able to listen to. We were in agreement that the sex scenes should have been different in terms of, I think it would have been more interesting to see less penetrative or heteronormative sex in general. The sex scenes between Samuel and Romy were talking about, so like it would have been, I think, a better film if either two things happened, one, they never had that type of penetrative sex because their kink dynamic was very different in what was leading up to it, but I think that the kink dynamic led them to have sex because she she wanted him more because he was fulfilling her needs. But that's not necessarily exactly the truth for a lot of BDSM scenarios, sometimes it's just this play that they engaged in before where she's lapping up the milk and she's sitting, she's crawling, she's bending down, he's fingering her stuff like that, but there's no penetration involved, which is really interesting, and I argue that it would have been cool to see even like, a scene where they are having penetrative sex and she's like, No, like, and like, puts herself back down on the ground, and she's like, I want to do this instead. Or like, he is like, No, you're not getting off this way, and goes back to doing something else. But I think the aftercare scene was really great. I would have seen, wanted to see more of that from his point of view, where he's like, can you hold me? And it's like, yeah, like a dominant needs care afterwards as well. And I think people often don't see it that way. That's like, kind of the only moment where the scene between them ends, and it's the only moment where you see them bonding, almost as like friends. And I thought that was really beautiful. And I think if they had had more of that, though, the movie wouldn't have been as dramatic. So maybe, obviously, they did it for dramatic effect. Can you point out all of the kinks that you saw in the movie? Okay, let me go like scene by scene here. Okay, well, the first one, obviously, is the glass of milk. So this is both in terms of age play, but also, like, I don't know, I don't necessarily just see it as, like, age play stuff. And when I say age play, I don't mean like, acting like a physical like child. I'm talking more about creating a similar dynamic to that of someone who's ordering someone around, because it's like, I know best what's good for you and someone who's taking those orders because they don't have the agency to do it for themselves, I think that's kind of the scenario, and it's very taboo as well. I personally don't engage in any sort of age play stuff at all. So when I have questions about it, I view it from very like. Academic lens. I don't have any personal experience with it, and it's not a topic that I'm very comfortable discussing either. So it's like, start becoming very academic with it. But I think the glass of milk thing also was obedience. It's like, we're sitting here and everyone's expecting you to drink alcohol, but I'm making you drink this glass of milk, and you're gonna do it because you don't care who sees you're gonna do what I tell you to. And I thought that was very powerful in terms of setting the tone of that's a non sexual, sexual behavior. And then when she's paying or something, and he leans over and he goes, good girl, that's when the dynamic fully starts for them, I believe. Then there's the motel sex scene, where I think that there's submission and humiliation, but just the setting itself, like putting her in a grungy setting, is humiliating, I think, and it adds to the effecting a lot of people that are very wealthy or powerful, they a lot of the time, seek out being dominated in very grungy settings. They want to feel extra dirty. They want to feel unsure. They want to feel insecure of their surroundings, and it adds to it. So I think that that's a really great detail they put in there. And obviously there was just also maybe, oh no, one's gonna expect me to be here. Maybe it wasn't a part of the kink, but for a lot of people, it can be. Obviously, she also gets on her knees. She sits, she he turns her into the corner. And so he's, it's like a sense sensory deprivation. He doesn't let her see. She's really into sensory deprivation. She wants her eyes closed. She wants, you know, a lot of that, she wants to be turned away. Also she she wants anticipatory kinks, like you don't know what's coming next, and then there's wrestling. So that's a very primal kink. It also is like at that point, she's also asking very acting, very bratty, and you can see her transformation from brat into sub throughout the those two scenes. She's feeling chased, grabbed, and it's also rough. So it's that chasing kink, primal kink, bratty kink, like, there's a lot there, right? And then she eats like a little treat or something out of his hands, that I would call pet play. She's crawling. She's bowing to him. She's sitting. Some people use collars, like you've seen collars and masks. Also, it's not exactly about being an animal. Again. It's about obedience. It's about you're doing what I'm telling you to which is very hot for a lot of people. And then throughout the whole movie, we see this also with her husband, the pillow scene where she wants to cover her face or cover her eyes. She could be focusing on her own sensations. She could also be using as a way to play out another scenario in her head, which is sometimes easier for some people, when they can close their eyes or have their face hidden. She might also be able to let go and like actually have an orgasm when she's not face to face with her partner, and then throughout it too, there's the idea of being carried and babied. Is a big one for her. She wants to feel taken care of, and that's a big part of domination. It's not necessarily about being mean and being rude or being, you know, violent. A big part of being dominated is knowing what somebody wants or anticipating somebody's wants. And I believe they talk about it at one point in the film, but it's like anticipating what somebody wants and kind of making that come out of them and giving it to them in a measured way, or like, I know what's best for you type of thing, and if that bleeds into life outside of the scene, it can be very difficult sometimes for people to grapple with, because then it becomes controlling. And that's, I think, a big issue people have with BDSM and domination in general. DS dynamics, is that the only time they've experienced that is, like, maybe with a controlling partner. And the whole idea behind it is that there's freedom in restraint, and there is joy in obedience, and there's a lot more, and I'm not gonna be able to cover all of them in this episode, but also when he tells her to, like, Get undressed. When he's sitting He's telling her what to say and telling her that's like, that dynamic that's coming out, where it's domination and submission. And submitting to somebody doesn't mean giving them full reign. It's supposed to be we're creating a framework to play in. These are my boundaries. This is what I'm consenting to. I can revoke that consent at any time. That's what it's supposed to look like. But unfortunately for them, it didn't. And when she's like, lapping up the milk, that's also part of pet play or and a lot of people don't understand that one, but sometimes it's tied to, like, humiliation, because you're dehumanized a little bit, but also. Sometimes it's just an obedience thing. It's like you're doing this thing that's ridiculous, because you're my pet, and I tell you what to do, and I control you, and it's the feeling of you let go completely, and you're letting someone else take the reins. And that can be very exhilarating for someone, especially someone who makes a lot of decisions like every day. So some very specific listener questions about their personal lives. How can I tell my partner that I'm into something kinky? I can really relate to Romy and I'm so afraid of opening up because I'm afraid of being rejected. What do I do? The easy answer here would be like, work on your fear of rejection. But I don't think that that's the best answer I can give you. I would say because, you know, I'm very much like a realist in all of this. And I think, like the film itself is a really great example of that, of like things are not always perfectly by the book in real life, and people do a lot of different things to seek out the scenarios and sensations that they want, and sometimes it can go very badly. But I'm gonna tell you, if you are craving a very specific sensation or scenario, I would express your interest in it first without asking him to do anything to you, because a lot of the time, our rejection that we're fearing is somebody saying, I'm not participating in that, or you're weird for doing that, or like that's an odd request for me. So if you start to express that you are into kinkier things than he might be aware of, you could tell him that you have a scenario in your head that is really exciting, and remind him that fantasies don't need to necessarily turn into reality, but you just really want to share this fantasy with him, because you like him a lot, and you want to share more parts of yourself with him. You can also just literally ask or just tell him your fears, like, I'm afraid you're gonna judge me for this. I'm afraid to share this with you, because I'm not 100% sure how it's gonna happen in real life. But this is something that I think is hot. You don't even have to say, Oh, this is something I need to do, or want to do, or anything. You can just say, I get off to the idea of this and take it from there baby steps. Sometimes that's good. You can also show him something that, for example, you can take him to go see the movie baby girl, and be like, what did you think of some of that? Or, you know, the better thing to do in this scenario would not be to ask him first, just straight off of the bat. Be like, wow, I thought some of that stuff was really hot, specifically when he was picking her up and kind of swinging her around like a baby. I thought that would be really hot to experience that someday. And I've actually thought about that before. Was there anything in the movie that you found sexy, you know, that could be a good way to break the ice a little, and there's no expectation that, like, you need this or you want this right now. And so there's less kind of immediate danger of rejection, so to speak. Next listener, I had a really chaotic childhood. My partner had a very loving and stable childhood, but we are into the same kink. How could our pasts influence what we're into if we both grew up so differently? By the way, the kink is extreme bondage. Something the movie does well, is talk about like her childhood, and show like it was very chaotic and bizarre for her, and show like she's done a lot of work on herself, but these urges never went away, and it doesn't really matter if it was nature or nurture, because at the end of the day, she's still wanting to do this stuff. I think what you're talking about here is really important, your maybe traumatic childhood, or chaotic childhood, you said, and his stable, loving childhood. Is it something that you were maybe just both into in terms of like you both have similar aspects of your personality, and your personality responds very well to this specific kink for extreme bondage, for example, it's like, do you also just maybe you're both that type of person who enjoys the sensation more so than the mental aspect of it? Maybe, though, it's the mental aspect that is just driving you nuts, because you're both very fast paced and impulsive people, and then being put in bondage, or putting someone in bondage, whatever it is, helps you slow down and accept what is happening. Or you like the idea of sitting like staying in place. It's kind of an outdated notion that, like all kinks, are related to trauma. Obviously, there is an element for some people, where they can recreate a traumatic scenario and feel control over it. That's sometimes the case for people, but a lot of people realize that they're kinky from a really young age, and it's not a sexual thing. It's more like they are sensation seekers. I remember. Of my friends growing up, she would always want to play this game where she would have, like, a ton of blankets, like, and pillows, like, piled on top of her. And she was like, she would call it like, Princess and the Pea, and like, she would be like, Okay, now someone else, like, climb up top and see if you can sit on it. And like, let's see how much pressure I can take, kind of like, I guess, the reverse of the Princess and the Pea, where she can, like, feel the, like the P on in her mattress, like the little bean in her mattress. It was, you know, anyway, it was totally innocent childhood game and but she just really loved the sensation of, like, somebody like, like a gravity blanket. She's, like, really into gravity blankets. Today. She loves gravity blankets. And then she opened up to me that she also and I, she gave me permission to share this. It's so anonymous though, like, there's no way that you would know who this is. But she told me that she's actually like, like, recently she realized that her favorite position is when her boyfriend, they're in missionary and he's basically like, his chest is on top of her chest, like she can barely move. She's like, I love that feeling, and just the grounding, and it's very grounding for her, and she's never alluded to anything, even when we were little, that this was like a safety thing for her, like a trauma response, or any of that. It was just a sensation that she enjoyed. And of course, it's bleeding into the things she enjoys most, in sensations, which is sex. So it makes sense that those things would go together, you know. So it's not necessary that someone had to endure something traumatic in order to be kinky. I hope you enjoyed my recap, synopsis, thoughts on baby girl, and I'm going to be talking a lot more about kink with a really great guest in a couple weeks. So if you have any more questions about kinks, this was just broadly speaking of kinks. But if you have specific questions about specific kinks, or something you're into and you don't know what to do, or something you're seasoned pro in and you want a new perspective on, let me know there is a anonymous question box on beyond the bedroom.org in the show notes. And you can also DM me, email me whatever you want to do. You can leave a voicemail for the podcast as well, and you can do so anonymously. So let me hear all your questions. Remember, you can get a discount on my favorite sex toys at unboundbabes.com with the code BBIRNA check out all the discount codes, links, affiliate links, all that good stuff on beyond the bedroom.org. Sending you all my loves all the way from Brooklyn.